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**shakur420** · (This post was last modified: 09-18-2011 01:38 AM by shakur420.)

(09-17-2011 10:18 PM)1871 Wrote: No! You’ve just completely contradicted yourself.

Uh, yeah, that was the point. I asked how we reconcile this contradiction. Nobody cares about your studies, articles or whatever when they see their family in danger. When they're the ones who have to walk through that park at 2am because they were forced to take a certain job and have to get home. When they gotta walk their kids to school through a neighborhood like "Hamsterdam". Don't pretend that people don't have a real need for protection and that that protection can't be obtained through weapons, weapons including guns.

(09-17-2011 10:18 PM)1871 Wrote: they HAD to defend themselves from the result of a white owned gun industry - not because they wanted to but because they had to yes - but had the gun industry not existed it would have diminished the necessity - to a very great extent- for that to occur since rednecks wouldn’t have the guns to shoot black people.

...and drug dealers have never shot bystanders, right? Muggers and rapists have never shot their victims, right? People have never been successful using guns to protect their families from burglars, right? More importantly, Malcolm and the Panther's had to, other people don't have to, right?

(09-17-2011 10:18 PM)1871 Wrote: Overall the lack of the availability of guns diminishes homicide and serious injury fatalities

I agree with that, like I said, I've never looked into that deep, but from what I have read, that's the way it seems. Feel free to tell people who live in danger - abused by a relative or authority figure, living in violent and weapons infested areas, assaulted multiple times by police - and see how much they give a fuck what you think. And then, proceed to convince them that they should adopt your views as the law of the land.

(09-17-2011 10:18 PM)1871 Wrote: The root cause of terrorism is the arms trade...

Uh, no, it's not. The root cause is oppression, killing, economic and political disparity, marginalization, the domination of one over another. Look up the definition of terrorism. You don't even need weapons to commit terrorism, lol.

The means for people and states to carry out terrorism might be the arms trade, but it certainly is not the cause. State terrorism is carried out for profit, to secure markets, subdue populations, make an example. Non-state terrorism is carried out as a reaction to state terrorism in almost every case I've ever heard of. Not that I've reviewed the record extensively, but I'm up for a challenge if anyone wants to present it.

I don't think that dude ever said anything really important, but there were a few brilliant lines that came outta this motherfucker's mouth every now and then.

Quote:And I'm down with the shit too
For the stupid motherfuckers wanna try to use Kung-Fu
Instead of a Mac-10 he tried scrappin
Slugs in his back and, that's what the fuck happens

**shakur420** · (This post was last modified: 09-18-2011 01:51 AM by shakur420.)

(09-17-2011 11:11 PM)Lazarus Amaru Zion Wrote: goddamn! shakur just DESTROYED 1871

Nah, nah man. Dude is stressing important points, important points I mostly agree with (though that terrorism is caused by the arms trade thing is not one of those points). I just can't bring myself to tell someone that they can't - or shouldn't - take up arms to protect themselves or do whatever they feel is necessary. I can't do that when they live in the situations they live in. Like Hamas, how can anybody with a conscience, with a fucking ounce of common sense and respect for children, talk to Hamas about rockets? Like, what the fuck would you do if you were in their position? And they know, just like the statistics about more guns equals more gun deaths, Hamas knows that the more rockets they shoot off, the more reprisals from the IDF and U.S. will be laid on their people. I don't agree, I think that tactically, it's not the correct move, because it hinders their ultimate goal - protecting and serving their people. But condemning them? Come on. Trying to force their hand and say that they shouldn't shoot rockets? Who the fuck are you or I to say that? How many times have you stubbed your toe against the table leg and proceeded to punch the table, kick the wall, knowing that you're only hurting yourself even more, not accomplishing anything. But you still have the right to do it without someone lecturing you about it, right? This is what I'm talkin about.

**matt romney** · 09-17-2011, 11:53 PM

singh>gandhi

**shakur420** · 09-18-2011, 12:32 AM

(09-17-2011 10:10 PM)Lazarus Amaru Zion Wrote: chomsky isn't really a good source. the fact that he has sat in his suits and college offices while subcommandete marcos is taking arms against the government disqualifies him.

So, by that standard, Marx is disqualified as a good source too, right? Come on man.

p.s. I don't recall Chomsky saying that. But whether he said it or not, it's kid of irrelevant, no? You don't accept want the dude says just cause he says it. You accept (or reject) what he says based on whether it makes sense to you and the references he's citing (if any). Right?

**matt romney** · 09-18-2011, 02:57 AM

wait did we just loose a page of this thread?

**High Nigga Pie** · 09-18-2011, 02:58 AM

Yeah, what the fuck happened?

**matt romney** · 09-18-2011, 02:59 AM

oh we had a new thread be made. mod, please delete these two posts and add those onto the new thread

**High Nigga Pie** · (This post was last modified: 09-18-2011 03:02 AM by High Nigga Pie.)

Whats the name of the thread?

Forget it...

**shakur420** · 09-18-2011, 03:03 AM

I didn't like the tone of your bullshit, so I got rid of it. I don't really believe in Democracy...

lol
http://www.immortaltechnique.co.uk/Threa...definition

**1871** · 09-18-2011, 06:19 AM

Both shakur and Lazarus are incorrect on this but I'll return to explain why in a while.

**jdudetheweasel** · 06-25-2012, 03:18 AM

I personally think certain people shouldn't have them for example active criminals and diagnosed sociopaths especially. I also think there should be limits on what weapons one can have. For example if there were no regulations someone could go out and buy a Patriot Missile and put it in their garage..... That could end really badly. I think fully automatic weapons (Assault rifles, Submachine guns, Machine pistols etc.) should be banned but Im fine with someone owning a shotgun, handgun or hunting rifle. I support regulations on silencers, scopes and other millitary equipment.

**matt romney** · 06-25-2012, 03:21 AM

Assange is an active criminal. I'm an active criminal. Eugene Debbs was an active criminal. Your friend who pirated music collection was an active criminal.